View Full Version : Chisum (1970)


Kevin
January 10th, 2006, 07:43 PM
Chisum (director: Andrew V. McLaglen; screenwriter: Andrew J. Fenady/from the sory by Andrew J. Fenady "Chisum and the Lincoln County Cattle War"; cinematographer: William H. Clothier; editor: Robert Simpson; music: Dominic Frontiere; cast: John Wayne (John Simpson Chisum), Forrest Tucker (Murphy), Geoffrey Deuel (Billy the Kid), Patric Knowles (Henry Tunstall), Pamela McMyler (Sally Chisum), Ben Johnson (Pepper), Glenn Corbett (Pat Garrett), Christopher George (Dan Nodeon), Andrew Prine (Alex McSween), Lynda Day (Sue McSween), Bruce Cabot (Sheriff Brady), Robert Donner (Morton, deputy sheriff), Ray Teal (Justice J.B. Wilson), Gregg Palmer (Karl Riker), Alan Baxter (Gov. Axtell), Richard Jaeckel (Jess Evans); Runtime: 110; MPAA Rating: G; producer: Andrew J. Fenady; Warner Brothers; 1970)

Reviews:

A stylish big-budget rousing range war Western that is a gimmicky mix of myth and hokum, directed with flair by Andrew V. McLaglen; it plays cutesy with the Billy the Kid (Geoffrey Deuel) and Pat Garrett (Glenn Corbett) movie lore legend and touches on the actual history of the Lincoln County Cattle War but in a Hollywoodish way, something that almost fouls up the fictionalized John Simpson Chisum (John Wayne) part. He's the staunch reformed Indian fighter and gunslinger who is now an Indian lover and honest cattle baron on the side of the little guy and frontier justice (overlooking the fact he was a monopolist before the arrival of his villainous rival). Chisum is the good-guy capitalist fighting the evil capitalist Murphy (Forrest Tucker), a newcomer to the 1878 New Mexico Territory town of Lincoln who is buying out all the local businesses through legal and semi-legal means while expanding his ranch and bribing the law as far away as in the capital, where the unprincipled appointed frontier governor sits, and locally through his stooge Sheriff Brady.*

It's produced and scripted by Andrew J. Fenady, from his story "Chisum and the Lincoln County Cattle War."

Reviewed by Dennis Schwartz ([Only registered and activated users can see links])

Kevin
January 10th, 2006, 07:48 PM
I personally like this take on the Lincoln Co. Cattle Wars, but at times I feel it drags along. I'm un-sure of the whole Billy the Kid with a Bible thing but maybe someone can address that part of the story. Chisum is a classic Duke westerns set on a big canvas, with just about all the Duke regulars making appearances. ;)

Thanks my quick take on it.

:cowboy:

thesherrif
January 10th, 2006, 11:27 PM
I have always enjoyed Chisum. I never cared for the actor who played Billy the Kid. But it was classic Duke!!

DukePilgrim
January 11th, 2006, 05:49 PM
I always like this movie it was well paced western with lots of action and pretty of familar faces from other Wayne movies like Ben Johnston Richard Jaeckel , John Agar (blink and you miss him) Bruce Cabot and Forrest Tucker. Also Hank Worden (Old Mose from The Searchers) as the stagecoach manager.

Billy the Kid's character was played by Geoff Duel who was the brother of Pete Duel who starred in the 1970s western series Alias Smith & Jones.

erthomp143
January 11th, 2006, 06:37 PM
I justed watched Chisum today and it beats the heck out of Young Guns.... Only thing I had a hard time with is being able to tell it's his double way to often in the last fight scene...

Kevin
January 11th, 2006, 06:41 PM
Originally posted by erthomp143@Jan 11 2006, 05:37 PM
I justed watched Chisum today and it beats the heck out of Young Guns.... Only thing I had a hard time with is being able to tell it's his double way to often in the last fight scene...
25235



I agree, they could have done a much better job of covering that up :blink:
It was quite noticeable.

ethanedwards
January 20th, 2006, 01:11 PM
Hi,
In addition to Kevins excellent review,
I'd like to add some more information, regarding
this very fine film.
It is one that I have always, enjoyed,
even right down to the title song!
Rating 9/10


CHISUM


1046

Information from IMDb

Full Cast

John Wayne .... John Simpson Chisum
Forrest Tucker .... Lawrence Murphy
Christopher George .... Dan Nodeen
Ben Johnson .... James Pepper
Glenn Corbett .... Pat Garrett
Andrew Prine .... Alex McSween
Bruce Cabot .... Sheriff Brady
Patric Knowles .... Henry Tunstall
Richard Jaeckel .... Jess Evans
Lynda Day George .... Sue McSween (as Lynda Day)
Geoffrey Deuel .... Billy 'The Kid' Bonney
Pamela McMyler .... Sallie Chisum
John Agar .... Amos Patton
Lloyd Battista .... Neemo
Robert Donner .... Morton (deputy sheriff)
Ray Teal .... Justice J.B. Wilson
Edward Faulkner .... James J. Dolan
Ron Soble .... Charley Bowdre
John Mitchum .... Baker (deputy sheriff)
Glenn Langan .... Colonel Dudley
Alan Baxter .... Gov. Sam Axtell
Alberto Morin .... Juan Delgado
William Bryant .... Jeff
Pedro Armendáriz Jr. .... Ben (as Pedro Armendariz Jr.)
Christopher Mitchum .... Tom O'Folliard
John Pickard .... Aggressive sergeant
Abraham Sofaer .... Chief White Buffalo
Gregg Palmer .... Karl Riker
Hank Worden .... Stationmaster
Pedro Gonzales-Gonzales .... Mexican rancher (as Pedro Gonzales Gonzales)
Jim Burk
Eddy Donno
Bob Morgan
rest of cast listed alphabetically:
William Conrad .... Narrator - Opening Credits (voice) (uncredited)
José Ángel Espinosa 'Ferrusquilla' .... (uncredited)
Cliff Lyons .... (uncredited)
Josh McLaglen .... (uncredited)
Mary McLaglen .... (uncredited)
Chuck Roberson .... Trail herder (uncredited)
Trinidad Villa .... Blacksmith (uncredited)
Ralph Volkie .... Blacksmith (uncredited)



Produced by
Andrew J. Fenady .... producer
Michael Wayne .... executive producer (as Michael A. Wayne)

Original Music by
Dominic Frontiere (also songs "Turn Me Around" and "Ballad of John Chisum")

Cinematography by
William H. Clothier (director of photography)



Stunts

Dick Bullock .... stunts (uncredited)
Jim Burk .... stunts (uncredited)
Joe Canutt .... stunts (uncredited)
Tap Canutt .... stunts (uncredited)
Eddy Donno .... stunts (uncredited)
Chuck Hayward .... stunts (uncredited)
Cliff Lyons .... stunt coordinator (uncredited)
Cliff Lyons .... stunts (uncredited)
Gary McLarty .... stunts (uncredited)
Bob Morgan .... stunts (uncredited)
Hal Needham .... stunt coordinator (uncredited)
Bob Orrison .... stunts (uncredited)
Chuck Roberson .... stunts (uncredited)
Henry Wills .... stunts (uncredited)

Filming Locations

Durango, Mexico

Eaves Movie Ranch - 105 Rancho Alegre Road, Santa Fe, New Mexico, USA

Santa Fe, New Mexico, USA


Trivia

* While in production on this film in Mexico, John Wayne won the Golden Globe and found out he was nominated for the Oscar for True Grit (1969).

* Although they met some time earlier Christopher George and Linda Day fell in love and later married after working on this project.

* Both Ralph Volkie and Trinidad Villa are credited as the blacksmith in various reference works.

Goofs

* Crew or equipment visible: During the ambush of the supply train, the shadow of a camera and crew is visible in the dust at the bottom of the frame.

* Revealing mistakes: John Wayne's stunt double is very obvious in fight scene between Chisum and Murphy.

* Crew or equipment visible: When Chisum and Murphy go over the porch together at the end of the film, the overhead shot of their fall reveals a poorly-concealed mat stretched over the dirt road below.

WaynamoJim
January 20th, 2006, 08:44 PM
OK Keith, question for you. IN the scene at the river where Chisum confronts the rustlers, just before Bonney rides up, who's the rustler Chisum is talking to about taking his herd back. I've seen the guy in a few other films but, never knew who he was. I liked his character in this movie, humorous but, deadly.

ethanedwards
January 20th, 2006, 08:52 PM
Hi WaynamoJim
Without quickly watching the film,
I believe this is Pedro Armendáriz Jr. .... Ben.
son of one of Duke's old co-stars PA Snr.he of 3 GODFATHERS,
and THE CONQUEROR.
However, I'd like to take another look,

WaynamoJim
January 22nd, 2006, 10:54 PM
I never really seen Jr. when he was younger but, I do remember him from Tombstone as the priest at the beginning who's gunned down by Ringo. As for Pedro Sr., he was also in Fort Apache and even did a James Bond film, From Russia With Love as a Turkish police official who sort of partners up with Bond during the first half of the film.

ethanedwards
January 24th, 2006, 06:50 AM
Memorable Quotes

Sallie Chisum: I think in some ways, the two of them are a lot alike.
Pat Garrett: Who?
Sallie Chisum: Uncle John, Billy Bonney. Don't you think they are? Don't you?
Pat Garrett: Not in the important things.
Sallie Chisum: Like what?
Pat Garrett: Well, Mr. Chisum's changed with the times. He doesn't like to let on, but he cares... about the people here and in town, about the Indians and the territory. Well, he's independent, and he likes to do things his own way, but he cares.
Sallie Chisum: And Billy doesn't?
Pat Garrett: I guess he can't help it. But you heard him, all he cares about is gettin' those men.
Sallie Chisum: In a way, doesn't it amount to the same thing?
Pat Garrett: No. Billy wants revenge. Mr. Chisum wants justice. There's a big difference.

Lawrence Murphy: Sheriff Brady, Jess Evans, this is Alex McSween. Uh, he's part of the family.
Jess Evans: Howdy.
Sheriff Brady: What does he do?
Lawrence Murphy: Well, he used to be a storekeeper and now he's my lawyer.
Jess Evans: I prefer storekeepers!
Alex McSween: Then don't ever get arrested.
Jess Evans: I don't intend to.

Jess Evans: Why get in a frazzle over Chisum? You turn me loose on him... there'll be a sudden funeral right here in Lincoln.
Lawrence Murphy: Uh-huh. Yours.
Jess Evans: How's that?
Lawrence Murphy: Do you play chess?
Jess Evans: Chess? What the hell has that got to do with Chisum?
Lawrence Murphy: Everything. You just leave him alone. I'll take care of Mr. Chisum.
Sheriff Brady: That ain't gonna be easy.
Lawrence Murphy: You're right. But see, there's a fundamental difference between Mr. Chisum and me.
Sheriff Brady: Yeah, what's that?
Lawrence Murphy: Mr. Chisum is a man who respects the law.
[Chuckles]
Lawrence Murphy: Around here, I'm the man who owns it.

Lawrence Murphy: And you good people witnessed the cowardly and cold-blooded murder of our beloved Sheriff Brady by Billy "the Kid" Bonney right over there. Governor Axtell has appointed a new sheriff, Dan Nodeen. He's offered a $200 award for the kid, and I'm adding a further reward of $1,000, dead or alive.
[Crowd murmurs "$1200"]
Lawrence Murphy: Sheriff here has formed his posse. Oh... Have you got anything you want to add to that, Sheriff?
Dan Nodeen: Just this. I'm going to bring Bonney in. Now you people can either help me, or stay the hell out of my way!

Justice J.B. Wilson: Mr. Murphy. Just how much of Lincoln County are you after?
Lawrence Murphy: Well, Mr. Chisum came out here several years ago, put his name on everything he could. I've only been here a little while. Just getting started. Do you have anything to say to that, Mr. Chisum?
John Simpson Chisum: Well I don't favor talking to vermin, but I'll talk to you just this once. You're not just getting started. The line's been drawn. What Billy did balanced the books so far. But if one of your men cross my land or even touch one of my cows, or do anything to that store, I'm not going to the sheriff, the governor, or the president of the United States. I'm coming to see you.
Lawrence Murphy: Hmph. Mr. Chisum, that sounds like a threat.
John Simpson Chisum: [John Chisum belts Murphy, knocking him down with his right fist] Wrong word. FACT!

Henry Tunstall: John, I want to thank you for taking care of William.
John Simpson Chisum: [chuckles] No, not me, Sally.
Henry Tunstall: She's a wonderful girl, she's a worthwhile lamb.
John Simpson Chisum: Oh yeah, Henry, according to you, everybody's worthwhile.
Henry Tunstall: God's children, John. Oh, William reminds me of someone.
John Simpson Chisum: A black sheep in the family, no doubt.
Henry Tunstall: No, a young chap I never even talked to. Years ago in England this man very much like William killed a man in some senseless brawl. And I watched that young man walk to the gallows. And I saw him hang. Ghastly sight. There was nothing I could do to help that young lad.

John Simpson Chisum: I'm going down there, the rest of you cover me with your long guns.
[James Pepper follows Chisum]
John Simpson Chisum: I said cover me!
James Pepper: I know what you said, Mr. Chisum! But I ain't the rest of them!

Billy the Kid: It's nice to have you with us Big Casino!
Pat Garrett: Thanks, Little Casino.

Pat Garrett: Well, I'm upwind and I smell it on you.
Billy the Kid: Buffalo?
Pat Garrett: Death.
Billy the Kid: I see what you mean. Can it ever go away? That smell I mean.
Pat Garrett: Sure it can, with time, good company and patience.

Billy the Kid: I made you a promise, Mr. Tunstall. Now I'm making myself a promise. It says in the Bible, "The candle of the wicked shall be put out."

Jess Evans: That man there, he's meaner than a gut shot grizzly.

James Pepper: You know, there's an old saying, Miss Sally. There's no law west of Dodge and no God west of the Pecos. Right, Mr. Chisum?
John Simpson Chisum: Wrong, Mr. Pepper. Because no matter where people go, sooner or later there's the law. And sooner or later they find God's already been there.

Morton: You're going to shoot us, ain't you Chisum?
John Simpson Chisum: I thought about it. Then I thought about something Henry Tunstall once said. He watched a man walk to the gallows... saw him hang. He said it was ghastly. Well, I've seen men hang, and that's the word - ghastly. You two are going to hang.

Neemo: So if you want these horses, I sell them to you. Did you bring some gold with you?
John Simpson Chisum: No.
Neemo: Silver?
John Simpson Chisum: Just lead!

Sheriff Brady: He's deader than a can of corned beef. You just had to kill him, huh?
Dan Nodeen: A whole lot less trouble that way.

John Simpson Chisum: We may have to be neighbors, but I don't have to be neighborly.

James Pepper: What are you going to do?
John Simpson Chisum: What I had done twenty-five years ago. Pat, get the men out of South Camp. Trace, you round up everybody that can ride a horse or pull a trigger. Let's break out some Winchesters!

James Pepper: Would you like to hear my opinion, Mr. John Simpson Chisum?
John Simpson Chisum: Nope.
James Pepper: Well, my opinion is all this speechifying, storekeeping, prayer-meeting don't amount to spit in the river. There's only one thing that's going to make this territory know who's bull of the woods... and sometime or sooner it's going to happen.
John Simpson Chisum: Do I?
James Pepper: You do. It's just going to be you and Murphy, head-to-head and horn-to-horn... and one hell of a fight. But one of you has got to lose, so the other one walks away with the herd and the whole shebang. Now, that's my opinion.

INFORMATION IMDb

chester7777
February 5th, 2006, 11:36 PM
Definitely another great film of the Duke's.

Deep Discount DVD ([Only registered and activated users can see links]) has the movie, and several different posters.

Amazon ([Only registered and activated users can see links]) offers the movie in new and used. The price for shipping one item used on Amazon is $3.49 (standard shipping). Sometimes the cost of the used item, plus shipping, is so close to new you might as well have a new one.

Chester :newyear:

Senta
February 18th, 2006, 12:36 AM
Hi all,
I bought 2 zone DVD of Chisum in Finland and the quality is exellent. I watch movie with new eyes. Also there is documentary, trailer and audiocommentc by Andrew McLaglen.
Regards,
Senta

Logolight
September 9th, 2006, 02:25 AM
Does anyone know the names of the supporting actors who played the ranch herders named "Charlie"(big teeth) and "Tommy"(blonde hair)? They were Billy's side kicks when he broke into the General Store and "Charlie" was the one who brought out the extra ammo from the storage room and said "There's enough ammunition in there to fight a war!". The cast listings that I've seen don't credit these two actors. Thanks.

Senta
September 9th, 2006, 04:16 AM
Originally posted by Logolight@Sep 9 2006, 08:25 AM
Does anyone know the names of the supporting actors who played the ranch herders named "Charlie"(big teeth) and "Tommy"(blonde hair)?* They were Billy's side kicks when he broke into the General Store and "Charlie" was the one who brought out the extra ammo from the storage room and said "There's enough ammunition in there to fight a war!".* The cast listings that I've seen don't credit these two actors.* Thanks.
34360

Hi,
I think Tommy is Christopher Mitchum (Mitchum's son). I don't remember Charlie, but I have a feeling that he was somewhere else. Arthur knew it all exactly.
Regards,
Senta :rolleyes:

Stumpy
September 9th, 2006, 08:28 AM
You can find the answer to almost any question concerning movies at IMDB's ([Only registered and activated users can see links]) website.

Stumpy
September 9th, 2006, 08:31 AM
Originally posted by Stumpy@Sep 9 2006, 06:28 AM
You can find the answer to almost any question concerning movies at IMDB's ([Only registered and activated users can see links]) website.
34363


This ([Only registered and activated users can see links]) is another excellent site for movie questions.

arthurarnell
September 9th, 2006, 12:50 PM
Hi
Looking at IMDB I would suggest that the second man was Ron Soble.

Regards

Arthur

Senta
September 9th, 2006, 04:06 PM
Hi all,
the finest information on both must be in our site in movie reviews. Search topics devoted to Chris Mitchum and Ron Soble. Eathanedwards (Keith) gathered some information on both.
Good luck,
Senta :rolleyes:

Senta
September 9th, 2006, 04:17 PM
[Only registered and activated users can see links]
This is the link to pals of the Saddle, you may go right there, a big information about both. How can we forget :unsure:

dc65
October 15th, 2006, 12:41 PM
Chisum is a great mix of myth and reality. After watching the movie, I did just a little research about the Lincoln County war and the real life Chisum and found a few things out. Namely that Pat Garrett and Billy The Kid never met like in the movie. Garrett was brought on to be Sherriff with the specific task of getting rid of Billy after he had become a menace to everyone.

As far as the movie goes, I don't really care whether the facts are hard and fast because that gets in the way of a good story. Here's a great movie about good and bad and the lines are certainly blurred when it comes to Billy (obviously) and Chisum when he decides to take vengence himself once his lawyer is killed.

A great western, maybe his best of the seventies (if you over look the sentimentality of The Shootist)

ethanedwards
November 16th, 2006, 10:00 PM
Duke's Movie Locations

Most of the movie was filmed,
around
J.W. EAVES MOVIE RANCH
969

970

971

972

973



Located in Santa Fe, New Mexico, the J.W. Eaves Movie Ranch was opened in the early 1960's with their first production being the CBS television series Empire in 1962. Over 250 other productions have filmed here over the years including The Cheyenne Social Club, Chisum, Easy Rider and Young Guns II.

ethanedwards
February 20th, 2007, 10:08 PM
Rare Photo

14801509

chester7777
February 21st, 2007, 01:06 AM
It's interesting to me when there is more than one poster for a movie. I don't know all the history behind them, but I enjoy them.

Chester :newyear:

ethanedwards
February 21st, 2007, 06:03 AM
Once again thanks for posting, and once
again the standard of artwork, is very impressive!

chester7777
February 21st, 2007, 12:31 PM
Keith,

Thank you. This is one that Les Adams, from Abilene, Texas shared with us.

Chester :newyear:

arthurarnell
April 1st, 2007, 12:17 PM
Hi Jim

Just to confuse the issue more here's another one:


Regards

Arthur

stacy
April 3rd, 2007, 02:40 PM
Hey all of you John Wayne Fans!
I have been away for a while, and just wanted to say hi!
Speaking of Chisum, I love the picture of John Wayne, on his horse on the hill, looking into the distance. This is how I always will remember the Great John Wayne! Does anybody know if there is a poster or picture out there of him in that manor?
I have a room in my house dedicated to the Duke and have framed many pictures, this is my favorite room in my house, and shall we say peacful!!!
Good to be back!
Stacy :hyper:

Lt. Brannigan
April 26th, 2007, 02:00 AM
This was one of my least favorite John Wayne films, I say was because as I watch his films again I find that many of them that I remembered as being boring I rediscover them so to speak.

DukePilgrim
April 26th, 2007, 07:37 PM
Is it still one of your least favourites or have you reassessed film?

etsija
October 29th, 2007, 01:28 PM
Finnish, from 1970´s

"John Wayne is Chisum, the King of Pecos, who started the big cattle drives on the prairies"


[Only registered and activated users can see links]

Lt. Brannigan
October 29th, 2007, 01:44 PM
Is it still one of your least favourites or have you reassessed film?

I apologize for the long delay in replying but no I have not had the time to reassess this film.

Johnc
March 15th, 2008, 11:45 PM
Just got Chisum on DVD, having owned it for years on video

Great movie, hopefully get to watch it again today

It apparently is based on the Lincoln County Wars, of which I have ordered the book from Amazon.com

Still awaiting delivery

Johnc
March 19th, 2008, 03:25 AM
source: Wikipedia

John Simpson Chisum (15 August ([Only registered and activated users can see links]) 1824 ([Only registered and activated users can see links]) – 20 December ([Only registered and activated users can see links]) 1884 ([Only registered and activated users can see links])) was a wealthy cattle baron in the American West in the mid-to-late 1880s. Born in Hardeman County, Tennessee ([Only registered and activated users can see links]), Chisum's family moved to Texas ([Only registered and activated users can see links]) in 1837 ([Only registered and activated users can see links]), with Chisum finding work as a building contractor. He also served as county clerk in Lamar County ([Only registered and activated users can see links]). John Chisum got involved in the cattle business in 1854 ([Only registered and activated users can see links]) and became one of the first to send his herds to New Mexico ([Only registered and activated users can see links]). He obtained land along the Pecos River ([Only registered and activated users can see links]) by right of occupancy and eventually became the owner of a large ranch in the Bosque Grande, about forty miles south of Fort Sumner ([Only registered and activated users can see links]), with over 100,000 head of cattle. In 1866-67, Chisum formed a partnership with cattlemen Charles Goodnight ([Only registered and activated users can see links]) and Oliver Loving ([Only registered and activated users can see links]) to assemble and drive herds of cattle for sale to the Army in Fort Sumner and Santa Fe, New Mexico ([Only registered and activated users can see links]).
When Chisum died in Eureka Springs ([Only registered and activated users can see links]) on 20 December ([Only registered and activated users can see links]) 1884 ([Only registered and activated users can see links]), he was unmarried and left his estate worth $500,000 to his brothers Pitzer and James. While living in Bolivar ([Only registered and activated users can see links]), Texas ([Only registered and activated users can see links]), he lived with a young slave girl named Jensie and had two daughters with her. The relationship is described in the book, "Three Ranches West." John had an extended family living with him at the South Springs ranch in Roswell, and this family, along with hired help, often numbered two dozen at the main ranch headquarters. Chisum's niece Sallie Chisum, the daughter of his brother James, became a beloved figure in the area where she lived until 1934. Both she and her uncle John are honored by statues to their memory at Roswell and Artesia.

Lincoln County War

Chisum was a business associate of Alexander McSween, a principal figure in the Lincoln County War ([Only registered and activated users can see links]). With money, advice, and influence behind the scenes, he played a role in the dispute between the opposing factions of cattle farmers and business owners. When Lewis Wallace ([Only registered and activated users can see links]) took office as Governor of New Mexico on 1 October ([Only registered and activated users can see links]) 1878 ([Only registered and activated users can see links]), he proclaimed an amnesty for all those involved in the bitter feud. However, after Billy the Kid ([Only registered and activated users can see links]) surrendered to the authorities, he was told he would be charged with the killing of Sheriff William J. Brady ([Only registered and activated users can see links]).
Billy the Kid escaped from custody and went to see Chisum. Billy believed he was owed $500, but Chisum refused to pay, claiming that he had given Billy horses, supplies, and protection over the years in lieu of payment. Billy the Kid responded by promising to steal enough cattle to make up this sum. Billy's gang also stole from other cattlemen and became a serious problem in Lincoln County. His gang included Dave Rudabaugh ([Only registered and activated users can see links]), Billy Wilson ([Only registered and activated users can see links]), Tom O'Folliard ([Only registered and activated users can see links]) and Charlie Bowdre ([Only registered and activated users can see links]).
In 1880 ([Only registered and activated users can see links]), Chisum was involved in getting Pat Garrett ([Only registered and activated users can see links]) elected as sheriff ([Only registered and activated users can see links]) of Lincoln County. Garrett immediately attempted to deal with the problems being caused by Billy the Kid. In December 1880, Garrett shot dead two of the Kid's gang, Tom O'Folliard and Charles Bowdre. Soon afterwards Billy the Kid, Dave Rudabaugh and Billy Wilson were captured by Garrett.

Robbie
March 19th, 2008, 05:10 AM
That was rather interesting, thanks for posting it.

Regarding Pat Garrett, was he ever in Billy the Kids gang?

:agent:

DukePilgrim
March 19th, 2008, 05:46 AM
Thanks for posting John. Very Interesting.

Mike

26 bar ranch
March 19th, 2008, 08:52 AM
Here is a little story about the Chisholm Trail, and the John Wayne Film "Red River." that many people think was One Of The Best Westerns Of All Time ! :teeth_smile: [Only registered and activated users can see links]

Stumpy
March 19th, 2008, 08:55 AM
Here is a little story about the Chisum Trail, and the John Wayne Film "Red River." that many people think was One Of The Best Westerns Of All Time ! :teeth_smile: [Only registered and activated users can see links]













Only one thing wrong, Bill - it's actually "Chisholm Trail"

26 bar ranch
March 19th, 2008, 09:23 AM
Stumpy, your sure a Pickey Old ---- But What The Hell would I know about Spelling, I am just an Old Aerospace Engineer, and an Old Run Down Cowboy !!!But I Fix-It Just For You ! :wink_smile:

William Thomas Brooks The Third :wink_smile: I think I Spelled My Name Right ? :yeaahh::cowboy:

Stumpy
March 19th, 2008, 10:14 AM
Stumpy, your sure a Pickey Old ---- But What The Hell would I know about Spelling, I am just an Old Aerospace Engineer, and an Old Run Down Cowboy !!!But I Fix-It Just For You ! :wink_smile:William Thomas Brooks The Third :wink_smile: I think I Spelled My Name Right ? :yeaahh::cowboy:


I'm sorry, Bill, I posted the corrected spelling before I read your link, which gave the correct spelling. It was just a reflex, since I live right on the old Chisholm Trail.

Johnc
March 19th, 2008, 01:46 PM
Thanks for the link Bill, I enjoyed reading that :wink_smile:

Johnc
March 19th, 2008, 06:32 PM
In answer to Robbie's question
-----------------------------------------------




Early life

Patrick Floyd Garrett was born in Chambers County, Alabama ([Only registered and activated users can see links]) (near present day Cusseta ([Only registered and activated users can see links])). He grew up on a prosperous Louisiana ([Only registered and activated users can see links]) plantation ([Only registered and activated users can see links]) near Haynesville ([Only registered and activated users can see links]) in northern Claiborne Parish ([Only registered and activated users can see links]), just below the Arkansas ([Only registered and activated users can see links]) state line. He left home in 1869 and found work as a cowboy ([Only registered and activated users can see links]) in Dallas County, Texas ([Only registered and activated users can see links]).
In 1875, he left to hunt buffalo ([Only registered and activated users can see links]). In 1878, Garrett shot and killed a fellow hunter who charged at Garrett with a hatchet over a disagreement over buffalo hides. Upon dying, the hunter brought Garrett to tears upon asking him to forgive him.
Garrett moved to New Mexico ([Only registered and activated users can see links]) and briefly found work as a cowpuncher ([Only registered and activated users can see links]) before quitting to open his own saloon. A tall man, he was referred to by locals as "Juan Largo" or "Long John." In 1879, Garrett married Juanita Gutierrez, who died within a year. In 1880, he married Gutierrez's sister, Apolonaria. The couple had nine children.
[Only registered and activated users can see links] ([Only registered and activated users can see links]) [Only registered and activated users can see links] ([Only registered and activated users can see links])
Portrait of Pat Garrett from The Story of the Outlaws[2] ([Only registered and activated users can see links]_note-1)





Lincoln County War

On November 7 ([Only registered and activated users can see links]), 1880 ([Only registered and activated users can see links]), the sheriff of Lincoln County, New Mexico ([Only registered and activated users can see links]), George Kimbell, resigned with two months left in his term. As Kimbell's successor, the county appointed Garrett, a member of the Republican Party ([Only registered and activated users can see links]) who ran as a Democrat ([Only registered and activated users can see links]) and a gunman ([Only registered and activated users can see links]) of some reputation who had promised to restore law and order. Garrett was charged with tracking down and arresting a friend from his saloon keeping days, Henry McCarty ([Only registered and activated users can see links]), a jail escapee and Lincoln County War participant who often went by the aliases Henry Antrim and William Harrison Bonney, but is better known as "Billy the Kid". McCarty was an alleged murderer who had participated in the Lincoln County War ([Only registered and activated users can see links]). He was said to have killed twenty-one men, one for every year of his life, but the actual total was probably closer to nine. New Mexico ([Only registered and activated users can see links]) Governor Lew Wallace ([Only registered and activated users can see links]) had personally put a $500 reward on McCarty's capture.
During a December 19 ([Only registered and activated users can see links]) shootout, Garrett killed Tom O'Folliard ([Only registered and activated users can see links]), a member of McCarty's gang. A few nights later, the sheriff's posse killed Charlie Bowdre ([Only registered and activated users can see links]), captured The Kid and his companions, and transported the captives to Mesilla, New Mexico ([Only registered and activated users can see links]), for trial. Though he was convicted, The Kid managed to escape from jail on April 18 ([Only registered and activated users can see links]), 1881 ([Only registered and activated users can see links]), after killing his guards J. W. Bell and Bob Olinger.
On July 14 ([Only registered and activated users can see links]), 1881 ([Only registered and activated users can see links]), Garrett visited Fort Sumner ([Only registered and activated users can see links]) to question a friend of The Kid's about the whereabouts of the outlaw. He learned that The Kid was staying with a mutual friend, Pedro Maxwell (son of land baron Lucien Maxwell ([Only registered and activated users can see links])). Around midnight, Garrett went to Maxwell's house. The Kid was asleep in another part of the house but woke up hungry in the middle of the night and entered the kitchen where Garrett was standing in the shadows. The Kid did not recognize the man standing in dark. "Quien es (Who is it)? Quien es?" The Kid asked repeatedly. Garrett replied by shooting at The Kid twice, the first shot hitting him in the heart, and the second one did not hit him. (Some historians have questioned Garrett's account of the shooting, alleging the incident happened differently. They claim that Garrett went into Paulita Maxwell's room and tied her up. The Kid walked into her room, and Garrett ambushed him with a single blast from his Sharps rifle ([Only registered and activated users can see links]).)
There has been much dispute over the details of the Kid's death that night. The way Garrett allegedly killed McCarty without warning eventually sullied the lawman's reputation. Garrett claimed that Billy the Kid had entered the room armed with a pistol, but no gun was found on his body. Other accounts claim he entered carrying a kitchen knife. There is no hard evidence to support this; however, if he did so it is likely he intended to cut some food for himself, since he had no idea anyone was waiting for him. Regardless of how he died, Billy was a wanted criminal, and so Sheriff Garrett chose not to give him a chance to surrender.
Still, at the time the shooting solidified Garrett's fame as a lawman and gunman, and led to numerous appointments to law enforcement ([Only registered and activated users can see links]) positions, as well as requests that he pursue outlaws in other parts of New Mexico.

After the Lincoln County War

His law enforcement career never achieved any great success following the Lincoln County War, and he mostly used that single era in his life as his stepping-stone to higher positions. After finishing out his term as sheriff, Garrett became a rancher ([Only registered and activated users can see links]) and released a book ghostwritten ([Only registered and activated users can see links]) by his friend Ash Upson in 1882 about his experiences with McCarty. However, he lost the next election for Lincoln County sheriff and was never paid the $500 reward for McCarty's capture, since he had allegedly killed him. In 1884, he lost an election for the New Mexico State Senate ([Only registered and activated users can see links]). Later that year, he left New Mexico and helped found and captain a company of Texas Rangers ([Only registered and activated users can see links]).
He returned to New Mexico briefly in 1885. In October 1889, Garrett ran for Chaves County, New Mexico ([Only registered and activated users can see links]), sheriff but lost. By this time, his rough disposition was beginning to wear thin with much of the populace, and rumors of his less than admirable killing of Billy The Kid were beginning to affect his popularity. Garrett left New Mexico in 1891 for Uvalde, Texas ([Only registered and activated users can see links]). He returned to New Mexico in 1896 to investigate the disappearance of Albert Jennings Fountain ([Only registered and activated users can see links]) and Fountain's young son Henry.

dukefan1
April 6th, 2008, 12:30 PM
Here is an example of the book. Enjoy!

Mark

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badger
November 10th, 2008, 02:29 PM
was really disappointed with my dvd of "chisum"
bought it from "hmv" but the sound quality was really bad and distorted - it meant having to concentrate more to pick up the story line - what made it worse was that all the background info that you can go onto came out fine - was just the film that wasn t right

DukePilgrim
November 10th, 2008, 05:59 PM
was really disappointed with my dvd of "chisum"
bought it from "hmv" but the sound quality was really bad and distorted - it meant having to concentrate more to pick up the story line - what made it worse was that all the background info that you can go onto came out fine - was just the film that wasn t right.

Sounds like a faulty copy. Take it back and get another one hopefully that will help.

Mike

jpharrah
November 14th, 2008, 01:54 AM
I have been away for a while, and just wanted to say hi!
Speaking of Chisum, I love the picture of John Wayne, on his horse on the hill, looking into the distance. This is how I always will remember the Great John Wayne! Does anybody know if there is a poster or picture out there of him in that manor?


That image is on #2 of both the 8x10 and 11x14 lobby cards for the movie. Occasionally you can find them on Ebay. The image was also on the cast mug John Wayne gave away for this film. One of my favorite scenes too!