THE MAN WHO SHOT LIBERTY VALANCE

DIRECTED BY JOHN FORD
A JOHN FORD PRODUCTION
PARAMOUNT PICTURES

1048176

INFORMATION FROM IMDb

Plot Summary

Senator Ranse Stoddard returns to the city Shinbone in the Wild West to go to the funeral of his friend, Tom Doniphon. To a journalist, who's wondering what the senator is doing in Shinbone, he tells how his career started as "the man who shot Liberty Valance". As a lawyer he went to Shinbone, where he met his wife Hallie and Tom Doniphon. He taught the people there to read and write. Then he met the greatest bandit of the region, Liberty Valance....

Summary written by Tony Kessen

Writing credits (in alphabetical order)
James Warner Bellah screenplay
Willis Goldbeck screenplay
Dorothy M. Johnson story

Full Cast

John Wayne .... Tom Doniphon
James Stewart .... Ransom Stoddard
Vera Miles .... Hallie Stoddard
Lee Marvin .... Liberty Valance
Edmond O'Brien .... Dutton Peabody (Editor of the Shinbone Star)
Andy Devine .... Marshal Link Appleyard
Ken Murray .... Doc Willoughby
John Carradine .... Maj. Cassius Starbuckle
Jeanette Nolan .... Nora Ericson
John Qualen .... Peter Ericson
Willis Bouchey .... Jason Tully (conductor)
Carleton Young .... Maxwell Scott
Woody Strode .... Pompey
Denver Pyle .... Amos Carruthers
Strother Martin .... Floyd
Lee Van Cleef .... Reese
Robert F. Simon .... Handy Strong
O.Z. Whitehead .... Herbert Carruthers
Paul Birch .... Mayor Winder
Joseph Hoover .... Charlie Hasbrouck (reporter for 'The Star')
Charles Akins .... (uncredited)
Mario Arteaga .... Henchman (uncredited)
Gertrude Astor .... (uncredited)
Leonard Baker .... Man (uncredited)
Danny Borzage .... Townsman (uncredited)
Robert Donner .... (uncredited)
Larry Finley .... Bar X man (uncredited)
Shug Fisher .... Kaintuck (drunk) (uncredited)
Helen Gibson .... (uncredited)
Sam Harris .... (uncredited)
Chuck Hayward .... Henchman (uncredited)
William Henry .... (uncredited)
Bryan 'Slim' Hightower .... Shotgun (uncredited)
Earle Hodgins .... Clute Dumphries (uncredited)
Stuart Holmes .... (uncredited)
Ed Jauregui .... Drummer (uncredited)
Jack Kenny .... (uncredited)
Anna Lee .... Mrs. Prescott (widow in stage holdup) (uncredited)
Jacqueline Malouf .... Lietta Appleyard (uncredited)
Ted Mapes .... Highpockets (uncredited)
Montie Montana .... Politician on horseback (uncredited)
Bob Morgan .... Roughrider (uncredited)
Charles Morton .... Drummer (uncredited)
Eva Novak .... (uncredited)
Jack Pennick .... Jack (barman) (uncredited)
Dorothy Phillips .... (uncredited)
Stephanie Pond-Smith .... (uncredited)
Chuck Roberson .... Henchman (uncredited)
Buddy Roosevelt .... (uncredited)
Charles Seel .... President, election council (uncredited)
Slim Talbot .... (uncredited)
Ralph Volkie .... Townsman (uncredited)
Max Wagner .... Poker game dealer (uncredited)
Blackie Whiteford .... (uncredited)
Jack Williams .... Henchman (uncredited)

Original Music by
Cyril J. Mockridge (as Cyril Mockridge)

Non-Original Music by
Alfred Newman (from "Young Mr. Lincoln") (uncredited)

Cinematography by
William H. Clothier (director of photography)

Second Unit Director or Assistant Director
Wingate Smith .... assistant director

Stunts

Chuck Hayward .... stunts (uncredited)
Tom Hennesy .... stunts (uncredited)
Bryan 'Slim' Hightower .... stunts (uncredited)
John Hudkins .... stunts (uncredited)
Eddie Juaregui .... stunts (uncredited)
Ted Mapes .... stunts (uncredited)
Louise Montana .... stunts (uncredited)
Montie Montana .... stunts (uncredited)
Bob Morgan .... stunts (uncredited)
Hal Needham .... stunts (uncredited)
Chuck Roberson .... stunts (uncredited)
Jack Williams .... stunts (uncredited)

Filming Locations

California, USA

Janss Conejo Ranch, Thousand Oaks, California, USA

Trivia

* Director Trademark: [John Ford] [cards] Liberty Valance plays the Dead Man's Hand (Aces and Eights) before going out to duel Ransom Stoddard.

* Many people take Gene Pitney's recording of "The Man Who Shot Liberty Valance" to be the theme song from the movie but,
as Gene himself reports: "The song `Liberty Valance' was written for the movie but for some strange reason never was put in the sound track.
Because of the prior success with "Town Without Pity" I was paid a bundle to record the song, and Burt Bacharach produced it.
He wrote the song with Hal David. There was some screw-up between the publishing company,
Famous Music, and the parent company, Paramount Pictures, as to why it never was in the actual film[...]
The most bizarre part of the story I found out a few years ago.
The actual music used in the film was from a 1938 Henry Fonda film called Young Mr. Lincoln (1939). Go figure that out!"

* At the beginning of the movie, in the scene in which Vera Miles comes near John Wayne's burned house,
the music from John Ford's Young Mr. Lincoln (1939) is played.

* Some of the earlier scenes in the movie, particularly in the restaurant, were apparently styled by John Ford as a mocking tribute to the films of his friend and fellow director, Howard Hawks.

* Tom Doniphon (John Wayne) refers to Valance as "...the toughest man this side of the Picketwire," then adds (of course),
"after me!" The Picketwire is not a wire fence dividing line; it was slang for the Purgatoire River, which flows into the Arkansas.

Goofs

* Continuity: Tom enters the house that burnt wearing a black shirt, but exits wearing a different grey one.
Then on the buckboard he is wearing a black one again.

* Incorrectly regarded as goofs: In the flashback, Tom Doniphon tells Stoddard that he killed Liberty Valance,
it is Stoddard who shoots first, than Doniphon. But since we've been shown that Stoddard can't hit the broad side of a barn (and in fact, his aim is wild),
Doniphon's probably right.

* Continuity: Right before the gun fight, Ranse goes to get his gun which he has hidden in a bag under his bed in the kitchen.
The bag he pulls the gun out of is his carpet bag.
At the beginning of the movie once the stage coach has been robbed, Liberty empties that same carpet bag of books and uses it to carry all of the stolen money. It's doubtful that Liberty returned the bag to Ranse once he was done with it.

* Incorrectly regarded as goofs: Ransom Stoddard, at the school scene, makes a reference to "truck farmer." This phrase refers not to the motorized vehicle, but to the much older use of "truck" meaning barter or commerce.

* Continuity: In the reverse shot during the climactic political rally, the opposing parties switch sides.

* Continuity: When we see Liberty Valance shot the first time in the film, he stands up with his left leg stepping on the boardwalk and then brings his right leg over his left leg, stepping actually on the boardwalk. On the "replay," Valance swings his right leg over his left, steps right into the street, and falls slightly forward without touching the boardwalk with his right leg at all.

* Continuity: During the statehood/territory political rally, when Peabody completes his nomination of Stoddard for Congress, Doc Willoughby alternates between standing on the floor and on a chair between shots.

* Factual errors: When Ransom Stoddard is found and brought to the Swedish innkepers, Nora makes him drink "Swedish aquavit", but in fact she offers him "Rød Aalborg" (translates: Red Aalborg) which is a Danish aquavit.

* Continuity: Dutton Peabody was a little lax in his typesetting. The SHINEBONE STAR newspaper Rance Stoddard complimented Peabody on ("Cattlemen Fight Statehood") was VOL XXX, No. 42. Then many weeks (or months) later at the election of delegates Liberty Valance picks up a newspaper ("Two Homesteaders Killed By Liberty Valance and Gang") which also carries the same VOL. XXX, No 42.

* Continuity: In front of the Tom's coffin, Marshal Link's hat appears and disappears between shots on the box which he holds.

* Continuity: When Tom Doniphon enters the room that the territorial convention is held, we can see several women watching the convention from outside the room. However, later when Tom and Ransom Stoddard leave the room (and when Ransom re-enters the room), the women are gone.

* Audio/visual unsynchronized: When Stoddard is setting the paint cans on the fence posts,
they make a tinny sound that clearly indicates they're empty. Yet when shot by Doniphon, they discharge a great amount of paint.

Previous discussion:-
The Man Who Shot Liberty Valance ([Only registered and activated users can see links])

Memorable Quotes

Ransom Stoddard: You're not going to use the story, Mr. Scott?
Maxwell Scott: This is the west, sir. When the legend becomes fact, print the legend.

Jason Tully: Nothing's too good for the man who shot Liberty Valance.

Tom Doniphon: Pompey, go find Doc Willoughby. If he's sober, bring him back.

Link Appleyard: As long as he behaves himself in this town I ain't got no, ah...
Ransom Stoddard: Jurisdiction.
Link Appleyard: What he said is right. I ain't got none of it.

Tom Doniphon: Whoa, take 'er easy there, Pilgrim.

Liberty Valance: You lookin' for trouble, Doniphan?
Tom Doniphon: You aimin' to help me find some?

Liberty Valance: HASHSLINGER; YOU OUT HERE?
High Pockets: I'd say that's Liberty Valance there now; wouldn't you?
Ransom Stoddard: Yes, I would.
Kaintuck: We'll b-b-b-be seein' you, Mr. Stoddard.

High Pockets: Well, Mr. Professor. We thought you'd left town. What are you doin' out here?
Ransom Stoddard: I'm waiting on Liberty Valance. Why doesn't he come out?
Kaintuck: Well, that's n-n-none of our b-b-b-business, Mr. Stoddard.

Tom Doniphon: Liberty Valence's the toughest man south of the Picketwire - next to me.

Ransom Stoddard: Marshall, I was wrong the other night. Under territorial law you do have jurisdiction. Now I'll draw up the complaint and you can arrest him.
Marshall Link Appleyard: Sure thing, Mr. Stoddard. I'll be pleased as punch to arrest... arrest him? Arrest who?
Ransom Stoddard: Why Liberty Valance; who else?
Marshall Link Appleyard: L-L-LIBERTY VALANCE! Oh, just as I was startin' to get my appetite back.

[Doniphan has justed faced down Valance in the diner]
Tom Doniphon: Well now; what do you supposed caused them to leave?
Peabody: Why it was the specter of law and order rising from the gravy and the mashed potatoes.

Nora Ericson: Poppa - put on your pants!

Link Appleyard: Mr. Peabody, you scared me! You know Liberty Valance is over in the saloon?
Dutton Peabody: I'd be a poor newspaperman indeed if I didn't know what everyone else in town knows!
Link Appleyard: He's awful mad about what people been sayin' about him and that holdup. Mr. Peabody, I don't know what to do.
Dutton Peabody: Do what you've been elected to do! Go over there and arrest him!
Link Appleyard: Arrest him!
Doc Willoughby: [Very drunk] As co, co,
Dutton Peabody: Coroner.
Doc Willoughby: And your personal physic, physic, physician; I advise you to eat supper and go to bed. No charge.

Peabody: Physician!

[Pompey has gone into the saloon after Tom]
Jack, Barman: Now, Pompey. You know I can't sell you any...
Tom Doniphon: [drunk] Who says so? Take a drink.
Pompey: No sir, Mr. Tom. You know I don't drink no drams.
Tom Doniphon: I said take a drink.
Pompey: No sir. We got horses to feed and a mare in foal. Let's go home, Mr. Tom.

Hallie: Rance, did you mean what you said about bein' able to teach me to read?
Ransom Stoddard: Teach you to read? Why, sure. A smart girl like you? Why you'll be reading in no time.
Hallie: I know the Good Book from preacher talk and all; but it would be a solid comfort to be able to read it on my own.
Nora Ericson: I know my ABCs in Swedish, but not in English.
Ransom Stoddard: Then I'll teach you too, Nora. Hallie will be my first pupil and you'll be my second.

Tom Doniphon: [Valance has tripped Rance in the diner causing him to spill a tray of food] That was my steak, Valance.
Liberty Valance: [Laughing] You heard him, Dude. Pick it up.
Ransom Stoddard: I won't pick...
Tom Doniphon: Hold it, Pilgrim. I said you, Liberty; you pick it up.
Liberty Valance: Three against one, Doniphon.
Tom Doniphon: Kitchen door; my boy, Pompey
[Valance looks and sees Pompey at the door holding a rifle]
Floyd: I'll get it, Liberty!
[Doniphon kicks Floyd]

Mayor Winder: [at the territorial statehood convention] The chair recognizes its old friend; that distinguished member of the Fourth Estate, founder, owner, publisher and editor of the Shinbone Star, the honorable Dutton Peabody, Esquire!
Dutton Peabody: Thank you, Mister Chairman; but you left out one thing, I also sweep out the place.

Ransom Stoddard: [Doniphon has just told Stoddard what really happened the night Liberty Valance was shot] But, Tom, what you did, it was...
Tom Doniphon: Murder, pure and simple; but I can live with it. Hallie wanted you alive.
You taught her to read; now go back in there and give her something to read about.

Link Appleyard: The jail's only got one cell, the lock's broke and I sleep in it.

Dutton Peabody: [to Liberty Valance and his gang who have been waiting for him in the newspaper office] Why, if it isn't Liberty Valance... and his myrmidons!

Doc Willoughby: Dead.

Floyd: Doc! Doc! Liberty's hurt!
Doc Willoughby: [walking to Valance's body] Whiskey, quick.
[takes a drink, turns Valance's body over with his foot]
Doc Willoughby: Dead.
[walks off]

Link Appleyard: Doc, they need you over at Mr. Peabody's. He's hurt awful bad.
Liberty Valance: What's the matter, Mr. Marshal? Somebody have a little accident?
Doc Willoughby: Another one of your 'accidents', Valance? I'm just waiting on the day they call me for you.
Liberty Valance: [tossing Doc a silver dollar] Paid in advance.

Dutton Peabody: [during voting for the territorial convention] Mornin', Tom. Give me a drink, Jack.
Jack, Barman: Bar's closed during voting.
Dutton Peabody: Bar's closed?
Tom Doniphon: According to your friend, Mr Stoddard, the bar is closed during voting. Says its one of the "Fundamentals of Democracy". No exceptions.
Dutton Peabody: No exceptions for the working press? Why, that's carrying democracy much too far!

[Reese and Floyd are trying to get a lynch mob together after Stoddard kills Valance]
Tom Doniphon: Can't a man have a drink in peace in this town!
[Grabs Flyd and throws him through the door]
Reese: Nobody's botherin' you, Doniphon.
Tom Doniphon: You are.
[Reese goes for his gun, Doniphon hits him]
Tom Doniphon: Marshal! What are we payin' you for? Run this scum out of town.
Link Appleyard: You heard the man! High Pockets, Kaintuck I deputize you to help run this scum out of town!
Kaintuck: Jack, hand me that b-b-b-bung starter!
[grabs Reese and hauls him out]
Link Appleyard: You tell those ranchers north of the Picketwire that it was me, Link Appleyard, run you out of town and I'll do it again if you ever come back!

Hallie: One steak for Mr. Peaboy, with fixins'.
Nora Ericson: Steak, beans, potatoes...
Peter Ericson: And a deep dish apple pie.
Nora Ericson: Someday he order something different and we all faint dead away.

Dutton Peabody: [protesting his nomination to the statehood convention] Good people of Shinbone; I beg of you; I,
I'm your conscience, the small voice crying out in the wilderness, I, I'm your father confessor! I. I'm; what else am I?
Tom Doniphon: Town drunk?

Link Appleyard: [in Stoddard's classroom] Hello, Marshall. Good to see you.
Link Appleyard: Afternoon, Mr. Stoddard. Just came by to check on my little family.
Ransom Stoddard: Good, good. Your head cold?
Link Appleyard: Oh, ah, sorry Mr. Stoddard.
[removes hat]

Amos Carruthers: [bringing his son to school] Caught him fishin' down by the creek.
Ransom Stoddard: Well, Herbert, catch anything?
Herbert Carruthers: No, sir, they weren't biting.
Amos Carruthers: Ain't you goin' to whop him?
Ransom Stoddard: No, he's too big.

Mayor Winder: [after a mounted politician working for Langhorne has rode a horse into the convention and performed rope tricks for the audience]
This is a convention, *not* a rodeo, Langhorne!

Liberty Valance: You got a choice, Dishwasher. Either you get out of town, or tonight you be out on that street alone.
You be there, and don't make us come and get you.

Tom Doniphon: [to Ransom Stoddard] Hey, pilgrim! You forgot your pop-gun!

INFORMATION IMDb

Hi,

447

Well this film, is an all time classic and in amongst
the top Duke films, ever made.
A great favourite, amongst fans, all over.
A mean, moody story,
made even more moody, by the fact, that it was shot in black and white.
Depending on which publicity you read, this was either, a Duke film,
or a James Stewart film, either way, neither of them cared.
Duke was brilliant in this film, and completely at home with his role.
Lee Marvin was, great, and it's hard to believe, that they could have made Donovans Reef, so poor.
Vera Miles, presented herself well, so did the clutch of Ford regulars,
including a part for ex-footballer, Woody Strode, who apparently
was restrained from, knocking the living daylights, out of Duke!!
At first critics failed to understand the film, but later, critical evaluation
grew more positive, and it is now classed
as one of the best films of its genre
Rating 9/10

Hi

I agree as this is one of my favourite John Wayne pictures.

Critics say that it was shot in black and white becaue much of it was filmed on a sound stage. They also say that Ford was becoming dissillusioned with the genre realising that his view of the west had changed or even worse, never existed at all.

The music you refer to is the Anne Rutlidge theme used as you correctly say in Young lincoln. The same music or mood music very much like it is also used in How the West Was Won or when ever Ford wanted to introduce sympathy or reminencesses. In How the West Was Won there are also snatches of the theme music from the film.

During the making of the picture Wayne was treated abominably by Ford. James Stewart worked hard to avoid upsetting Ford and managed to keep out of trouble until one day when Ford asked him what he thought of Woody Stoode's costume. Stewart replied that he considered it a bit Uncle Tom'ish and immediatey wished the ground would swallow him as Ford much to Wayne's delight announced to the cast that one of the members didn't like Strood's costume.

Ford had picked up that Stewart had a problem working with African Americans and used it as a stick to beat him.

Regards

Arthur

Hi

Another actor in the picture who managed to keep out of Ford's waywas Andy Devine. During the picture Ford had a habit of making actors he felt he wanted to make a point about stand in a barrel.

One day Devine was reading something and Ford asked him what he was doing. Devine immediately replied that he was reading his script. Satisfied Ford walked away. Laughing Devine said He's not putting me in that barrel.

Regards

Arthur

To me this has to be one of the ten best westerns of all time. I should watch this soon, it's been awhile. I think Edmond O'Brien stole the show in this one as Dutton Peabody. In the late 40's and early 50's he was considered a leading actor with DOA, Fighter Squadron, White Heat among his credits. He then turned into a character actor and this movie showed how good he was at it. Of course, he later appeared in The Wild Bunch as a grizzled old westerner. His one line in the film, "that's carrying democracy too far" over the fact that the bar's closed for the election is a classic. Also, Strother Martin and Lee Van Cleef were near as good as Valance henchmen who were only as tough as Liberty was still alive.

Arthur, thank you so much for all the "inside" information on this film. Did James Stewart have a problem working with African-Americans (is it documented anywhere)? I hadn't heard that before.

We consider this among Duke's classics, and have always enjoyed the large ensemble cast of "regulars" we have come to know and love as we watch all these movies.

The Man Who Shot Liberty Valance is available at Deep Discount DVD ([Only registered and activated users can see links]), and it is also available reasonably priced at Amazon ([Only registered and activated users can see links]).

Chester :newyear:

I'm not sure why the online ([Only registered and activated users can see links]) version of the Arizona Daily Star is running a review of The Man Who Shot Liberty Valance at this particular time, but it is interesting to note that the movie shows a rating of R! Certainly not by today's standards!

Chester :newyear:

Hi Jim/Sue

In James Stewart a Biography by Donald Dewy which is a very good read pages 461--3 go into this aspect of Stewart in some depth. I will not say Stewart was a racist because I don't personally believe he was, I believe his grandfather was but possibly that was a sign of the times and environmentment in which he lived, however I know nothing of the politics of Indiana to comment further.


What the book does say however is that Stewart was UNCOMFORTABLE with African Americans and rarely spoke to them, or had them on his show ,or even if they worked for him would rarely speak to them.

It is easy to stand back and criticise especially when the person is no longer with us. What needs to be looked at was that for many years Stewart was a fine actor and in time of war served his country very well. I believe quite fervently that three things are sacrisanct to any person, his religion, his politics and his ethnic beliefs.



Regards

Arthur

Arthur,

Thanks for that further information. Like you, I certainly don't believe for even a second that James Stewart was a racist - he was just too decent a guy for that. Being uncomfortable does not make one a racist. Many people who grow up in an area that is not very diverse, might end up feeling uncomfortable around people of other races, regardless of the race. Next year, in Monument Valley, I might feel uncomfortable around someone from the UK :lol: - or not :lol: .

It's too bad Ford had to use Stewart's discomfort against him like he did. We're constantly reminded what a really nice guy Mr Ford was . . . NOT!!

Chester :newyear:

Until I bought the 5-movie boxed set that includes "Liberty" I'm ashamed to say, I had never seen it. I have a really close buddy who is a huge John Wayne fan, who still has never seen it, so he's coming over in the near future to rectify that...

Anyhow, until a year or so ago, when I got the boxed set, I'd never seen it. Up until that time Rio Bravo had been my favorite John Wayne western, but after I saw Liberty, I've changed that opinion!!!!!!!

I think everyone LOVES the Duke because of his "standard" role of a good guy. Usually rough and/or stern, and sometimes gritty, I admit, but the Duke was always clearly a good guy. The two exceptions that leap to mind are his role in the Searchers and this one in Liberty. Granted, neither role was a villian, but they were decidedly dark, and I never have been able to get myself to like the Searchers. (I think it's the combination of dark role for the Duke, and the "artistic" shooting of the film. - It may win critical acclaim, but it's just not my style of western...) But when I watched Liberty, WOW!!

The Duke was showing he wasn't just a "one-role" actor who reprised the same role in movie after movie. Although some of his critics claim that's true, clearly, these other roles show that's wrong. Obviously, the Duke knew the kind of role that most of his fans wanted him to play, and that may have fit well with is personality, but it was equally obvious he was a very capable actor, when you see him fulfill roles that are different with such aplomb.

Anyway, I liked just about every angle of Liberty. The acting by all the roles, including (especially?) the supporting cast was excellent, with the possible exception of Lee VanCleef being a little over-the-top, which still worked, though, considering the main part of the movie was a "reminiscence" by Senator Ransom Stoddard to a newspaper man. (Hence we can tell ourselves that the characature-like aspects of VanCleef's role was added to the story by Stoddard as he was telling it to the newspaper man.)

The prop department, as well, pulled out all the stops. I really liked the cheap, small-frame top-break revolver that they dug up to give to Ranse to go up against Liberty. For us firearms-guys, that just underlined the juxtaposition of Ranse trying to go up against a villian. Also, can't deny the fun/neat aspect of the "shooting lesson" that Duke gave Jimmy Stewart that involved that revolver.

Filled with outstanding performances throughout and an interesting and catchy plot/story-line, as well as great sets and props, it is definitely my new favorite John Wayne movie.

To me, The Man Who Shot Liberty Valence (John Ford, 1962) is the best film that Wayne ever starred in (even better than the unforgettable yet flawed The Searchers) and one of my top-five all-time Westerns.

I also think that Wayne offers his best, most complex and intricate performance, more understated than Ethan Edwards in The Searchers and Tom Dunson in Red River (which are powerful performances in their own right), but highly underrated for that reason. To quote myself about the Duke's character in The Man Who Shot Liberty Valence:

Tom Doniphon may be Wayne's most complex character, tough, unafraid, and impeccably competent, but weary, fatalistic, melancholic, and ultimately depressed, self-destructive, and tragic. I don't think that he's "cocky" at all. In fact, from the second that he arrives on screen, we know that he's a forlorn figure, and most striking of all, we can sense that he knows it, too. As such a rugged, independent Westerner, he just doesn't quite have what it takes to succeed in romance, especially when compared to an articulate Eastern lawyer and future senator like Ranse Stoddard. Ultimately, Doniphon's stubborn, gritty, and autonomous brand of masculinity does him in.

[Only registered and activated users can see links] ([Only registered and activated users can see links])

Dukes Movie Locations

Most of the movie, was filmed in California,
with some memorable shots here at

977

978


JANSS CONEJO RANCH ([Only registered and activated users can see links])

Hi

[Only registered and activated users can see links]

Willis Boucey James Stewart Joseph Hoover Vera Miles and Andy Devine one of the opening scenes in The Man Who Shot Liberty Valance.

A great film.

Regards

Arthur

Hi

Confrontation 1

Hi

Confrontation continued

Hi


Doniphon about to humiliate Stoddard

Hi

A portrait photograph of John Wayne

Hi

Three Masters of their craft James Stewart, John Ford & John Wayne

Hi

Advertising posters for TMWSLV


English

Hi


European

I have to say this is one of my favorites... especially since I'm also a James Stewart fan. Just watched his Winchester '73 film this afternoon and reminded me of this movie he made with the Duke.

I just got through watching this film and here are a few random thoughts.

The story is good, but the leads are really a bit too old for their parts. I had trouble believing that the Duke was a young rancher although he did great in his part.

Also the format and texture of this film struck as if it was once intended for the stage as the musical score is very sparse and it's lacking that splashy Ford signature.

I did have a blast spotting all the familiar faces... Jack Pennick was a nice surprise. Woody Strode was excellent in his role and he brought a quite dignity to his role that played well off of Duke.

Once again, I felt that Duke should have beat the hell out of Valance and just when Valance looks like he's getting the upper hand Ranse could have shot him. But that's just me.

Over all this is a great collaboration between Pappy and Duke... all it was missing was Ward Bond.

I see some members in recent posts and threads(not just this one) are wondering about the theme music which plays several times in TMWSLV. Well pilgrims that music is an old time piece dating back to the civil war and quite possibly further yet.
The piece is titled "The Dew Is On The Blossom" !!!!!

Regards
Ethan

Isnt part of the music the same that was used in Young Lincoln with Henry Fonda?


Mike

Yes, Your exactly right !!!!! It also plays in " The Horse Soldiers" and a few others which rite now I'm at a loss to remember.

Regards
Ethan

Thanks for info Ethan

Watching that documenatary on Ford actually taught me something!!

Mike

This is a great movie with John Wayne playing arguably his most tragic character. Its clear from the outset of the film that Doniphan is not the traditional hero but someone who has little interest in maintaining law and order and who is more interested in their own personal affairs.

The black and white cinematography adds the necessary soberness and moodiness to the film and the film boasts many classic scenes not least the flashback within the flashback.

Overall I believe this movie is as close to perfection as a movie can get although its just not quite as good as the Searchers.
:agent:

Just finished watching this movie on TCM and I was wondering if I was the only one who thinks this.

In the flashback sequence when Tom is telling Ransom that he didn't kill Valance, it looked like Ransom got off his shot before Tom did. I haven't put this in slo-mo yet, but I was wondering if anyone else noticed this or if I might have missed this topic in another thread.

Your absolutely right... Ransom did fire the first shot but remember, he was a bad shot and missed Valance. A second after Ransom (Stewart) fired Liberty (Lee Marvin) and Tom (John Wayne) fired second, simultaneously. See below:

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Click to Enlarge

Thanks DakotaSurfer, I had not taken into account that Ransom was such a bad shot and great stills by the way.

Remember when Wayne found out Ransom was practicing, he took him to his place and shot the paint cans and got Ransom full of paint. Ransom couldn't hit the broad side of a barn. For the movie it would have been better if duke's shot was timed with Ransom's. But then Liberty wouldn't have gotten off a shot. I guess it's all in the script. And it did all happen in a split second.

Another question about this movie. In the scene where Liberty Valance just finishes robbing the passengers of the stagecoach and sends them on their way, he has the lead horses cut loose. What was the purpose of that?

I would reckon it was to prevent the stagecoach from getting into town too quickly and notifying the sheriff who would organise a posse after Liberty & the gang.


Mike

I would reckon it was to prevent the stagecoach from getting into town too quickly and notifying the sheriff who would organise a posse after Liberty & the gang.

Mike


Exactly, the number of horses in front of a stagecoach determined how long it would take. If it was a long trip they might even have 6 so they don't get tired too quickly and or course the stations they would stop at to change horses for fresh ones. If you ever watch Encore Westerns, or read True West magazine, Bob Boze Bell has a lot of interesting info on things just like this. The longer it took to get back to town the more time Liberty had to get back south of the picket wire. There is a flaw in many westerns on just how fast a stage could go when being chased. Those chase scenes are just for our entertainment. Most stagecoaches were robbed bandits waiting for them and shooting to frighten the horses and they were easily stopped by someone grabbing the bit on one of the lead horses.

I have Driven Both a 4 Up and a 6 Up Teams of Horses and it is Just that, Leading Horses, and when the Two leading Horses are turned by the Driver the Other Horses follow.
:wink_smile:

When you cut loose the Two Leading Horses , the other horses are not trained to follow the Pull of the Rains as the Leading Horses Are !!!
:ohmy:
Chilibill
:cowboy:

Wow, you learn something new everyday. Never thought I might learn how to drive a team of six horses. :hyper:

Of course, Doing it, verses reading about it, may be a little different.

Chester :newyear:

I read a little blurb in the paper today that Lee Marvin died on this date in 1987. It was amazing to me he had been dead that long.

I always thought Marvin was a great villan as Liberty Valance. The scene where Edmund O'Brien goes into his dark newspaper office, lights the lamp and Marvin is standing there made me jump the first time I saw it.

I wasn't that wild about the film the first time I saw it but it has grown on me. It's Ford's last great film. My only complaint is that everyone in it is 20 years too old for his part.

I My only complaint is that everyone in it is 20 years too old for his part.

Can't agree with you. May be if it was real life - you might be right. But this dark and disillusioning Ford's masterpiece calls for older actors.

Regards,
Senta

Wow, you learn something new everyday. Never thought I might learn how to drive a team of six horses. :hyper:

Of course, Doing it, verses reading about it, may be a little different.

Chester :newyear:I gotta agree with you there. I never knew why they cut those lead horses loose until now.

Arthur,

Those advertising cards/posters (you shared them on page 3 of this thread) are really neat.

I thought I'd finished placing posters in the 60s Westerns, but it seems I missed this one, so here it is now :wink_smile: -

2085

Not a bad movie, although it should have been filmed in colour and on location. Some of the acting was over the top, especially from Andy Devine and John Carradine. Only Duke coulod have played Tom Doniphan, I just wish they had used a younger actor than Stewart to play the young lawyer.

5/10.

Here is an example of the book from the movie. Enjoy!

Mark

[Only registered and activated users can see links]

It's the movie press kit posters first released in Japan 1962.
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[Only registered and activated users can see links]
H.sanada

On my slow road of discovery through the films of Mr. Wayne, I have just for the first time crossed paths with this strangely moving piece of filmmaking. This is the sixth John Wayne film I have watched in the past month, which began after I realized that I have foolishly been shunning his body of work for no good reason at all. Each film I have viewed has been a revelation, delivering the goods on both an entertainment and emotional level.

I just received Paramount's Century Collection boxed set, and I have begun digging in. I watched the Shootist first, which I greatly enjoyed, even though it was a bittersweet farewell to the Duke and left me a little sad at the end. I followed up with The Man Who Shot Liberty Valance and was absolutely blown away by it, and it has been lingering in my mind for the past few nights. It really left its mark on me. A real heartbreaking story. So many great stars and memorable faces in this picture. So many talented individuals the likes of which we'll never see again.

Of the 6 Wayne films I have seen thus far, Liberty Valance, like the man himself, pushes and shoves its way to near the top of my list of favorites, right up there with The Searchers and The Cowboys. I have liked everything I have seen thus far, and I plan on continuing with my next film tomorrow night, although I haven't decided which one to view yet (thinking about Island in the Sky...).

A near perfect 10 in my book.

Hi Zodiac

Welcome to the Forum. Great choices of movies glad you are enjoying them.

Best

Mike

This movie has been without a doubt one of my all time favorite John Wayne movies. I was so happy that it was filmed in black and white. It was my Dad's favorite.

i liked this movie but i still wish Duke would have got the girl. i mean i know it wouldnt have been as good but i would have liked it. i am a BIG Jimmy Stewart fan so that being said it was kinda cool to see him get the girl over Duke!

This is just a nice piece about and by Lee Marvin he died 21 years ago August 29.
[Only registered and activated users can see links]

Hi May2

I cant get your link. Is this it? [Only registered and activated users can see links]


Mike

That's it.

this story was heartbreaking - john wayne was mean, moody and magnificent and i can t believe she chose james stewart over him
i liked the way the story was told retrospectively and the fact that it was in black and white made it all seem more tragic somehow
lee marvin was brilliant as liberty valance but it made me feel so sad when jw admitted he shot liberty valance to please hallie
all in all, i m not sure..... i kind of like my john wayne films to have happy endings and this one didnt
loved the line though: -
Maxwell Scott ([Only registered and activated users can see links]): No, sir. This is the West, sir. When the legend becomes fact, print the legend.

Maxwell Scott: No, sir. This is the West, sir. When the legend becomes fact, print the legend.
Badger,
Here is our own dedicated thread:-
Pals Of The Saddle- Carleton Young ([Only registered and activated users can see links])

thanks for that ethan :teeth_smile:

This is one of my top all time favorite films of the Duke's. It's so beautifully filmed.